similarminds.com

[Dee]

Perpetual or a straight line like this --- B------A-----C (straight line where it hits a point and comes back to your main Type) OR OAO ( two circles on either side that overlap your main Type)?

I believe that OAO is more accurate and I'll tell you why. Our brain doesn't stop thinking and our thoughts move into other thoughts and ARE perpetual. So, what you have is your main motivation and the wings influence circling through your main Type and both are working at the same time but one is in your subconscience and they take turns this way. One of them might stay there so that you aren't aware of how it's manipulating your motivations.
Case in point. I know someone who thinks their shadow wing plays no part in their motivations yet I can see it clearly in this person and it comes in the form of the self-doubt that shadow wing causes in this persons thinking. I've tried tell this guy but he can't see it and understandably so.

Any comments on this? Perhaps a "booo" from the peanut gallery? ...lol

[invicta]

No Dee, I think that's quite insightful.

I know I like to think that progress is being made, and that personal progress is linear and traveling in a forward motion only.

But thinking that doesn't make it any more true. I don't suppose a person is ever "above" any past behavior or experience, or state of being. I think only that it becomes recognizable. And acknowledged after a while if we accept parts of ourselves we might not particularly like.

After that--well, let it loop around, so be it, it will happen anyway--but by accepting it everything gets a lot easier. I don't find any need whatsoever to control our feelings or instincts--that would just lead to suffering of one kind or another, no I think it's only necessary to control our actions. Feel what you will feel, that's honest.

Did I filibuster long enough?

[Dee]

thanks! Sometimes I'm rambling, like my little loop-dee-loop I did on the Type 4 thread and sometimes I'm not. Thanks for taking me seriously and being intuitive this way on this idea I had. I know it's probably been said before in text but a lot of what I come up with is just putting things together which I like doing, kinda like a puzzle I guess.

Here's another one...

What's your take on the actual Enneagram being a 5w4? It's set up so 1-ish but it has the 4 depth and the 5 logic. I find it to flexible but only to a certain degree. I think this is where the confusion lay is that depending on health level, one type can look exactly like another yet not be in the same triad. It's amazing how we want to pin ourselves down to one type and can argue that someone isn't that type because their motivations aren't the same as so and so therefore it doesn't make sense inducing the the 5 back to homebase where it does add ~
This might be why 5 is so interested in the concept because it's set up like the map of the 5 mind and the wing 4 for the fact that 4's tend to be runner up in interest because it actually encourages self-absorbtion if not careful. The 6 phobic perhaps because it's a community speaking of an interesting concept that they can share their thoughts and not feel it necessary to cp out because there's no hidden agenda in causing harm but only good. Don't get too personal with the cp 6 though because your motivations are questionable and not always welcome.
and yadda yadda... man, I think I just needed an enneagram fix the last couple of days cause I can't shut up now!

[invicta]

Dee,

You have a strong ability to access symbolic thought. It's profound, and it is quite beautiful.

It's Burroughsian in that way, and I think you can see beyond the trappings of the ego. I am glad you are back where I can talk with you.

As far as individual levels of "health" is concerned, I am not particularly fond of the abuse of that idea--when people don't agree with another the first thing they do is cast the judgment of "unhealthy" upon each other.

May as well just accuse your schoolyard nemesis of carrying cooties.

I understand your statement before, however--people with a firm attachment to their particular motivational structures (and fear of any rupture in their particular "reality") are almost always the most positive of their "type", and of course the "type" of everyone around them.

Sorry, I may have veered slightly from the strictly enneagrammatic theme of your statement.

[Dee]

thank you, Ivicta. That made me feel great, much needed, thanks.

Yes, I agree. However, I know that people who are Sensor are lower in being cautious and seem to wait for a general concensus before they will act to protect themselves. I get ticked off when I see people getting killed at a poorly designed crosswalks and the sensor wait until they have an ample amount of people killed off before they will do anything about it. In TV interviews, you'll hear the intuitives saying that they know this crosswalk is poorly designed and what were they thinking in the first place! More N is needed in the area of safety boards imho.
I find the sensor are actually the most fixated because their intuition is low in preference and they seem to take things for what they are and get on with it. 5's can be so intuitive that they can be idiosyncratic like that guy on the E board who spoke in all metaphor and some would pick on him thinking he can help being this way. I think I played with him a bit but I meant no harm, he was just alien-like but I know that he didn't mind because I wasn't judging him.
He imo had the 4 wing and in some instances like his, it made his five outta whack. A possible hybrid. Can't remember his name.. hmm, anyway...

Today is Toronto street festival and I have a date with this very nice guy. I thought he might be ISTP but seems to be more N now that I've gotten to know him better. He loves conversation that discuss possibilities that aren't concrete.

Everything I say by the way is open. I'm not saying I'm right with anything I say, more expressing myself and how I think. It's either food for thought or table scrap for the dog. lol

[invicta]

I even miss hearing about your boyfriends--you are lucky, you get some variety in your love life!

A street festival sounds like a perfect date atmosphere for getting to know someone. Let me know how the date goes and what your typing conclusions are!

[Dee]

Good morning!

Well, I'm going with INTP heavy on the P (like myself!) lol..
He's a 5w4 sp/sx/so from what I can tell. A loner with asthetic sensibility. No display of being overly cautious or overly critical. He's not group focused at all (like myself). Knows more than I feel comfortable with...LOL
I think I got it right, well see.

[Vagabond]

An INTP 5w4 sp/sx... oh boy... good luck with this one (you are going to need it )
_________________
Ο δικός μου ο δρόμος μ' έχει χρόνια διαλέξει...
INTP 5w4 sp/sx

[Dee]

LOL...
Actually, I'm thinking he might be the 9w1 now. It's a toss up. Can you let me know what a deciding factor might be; what might be the main difference between the 5w4 sp/sx/so and 9w1 sp/sx/so?


I'm avid in Oldham Styles as some might know... he's the Leisurely Style paramount. He also has the Solitary Style but this Style is seen a lot in the Leisurely Style. Type 9 in enneagram is rather Devoted Stylish as well which isn't a 5-ish thing at all, but I notice he has some of this Style in him. Yeah, he's probably the 9w1. I've had a bit of the 1 thing to deal with but lucky for me I have a strong line to 1 and have much respect for this trait in people.

[Vagabond]

I am definitely not an expert, however chances are that, if he responds to almost every suggestion you make with "yes dear", he is a Nine. If instead he usually goes like "Yes, but..." or anything that comes with a "but", you just have to pray for extra patience... you got unlucky B)

(Actually, us sp/sx 5w4s are the most adorable creatures on earth... once you get used to us...)
_________________
Ο δικός μου ο δρόμος μ' έχει χρόνια διαλέξει...
INTP 5w4 sp/sx

[Dee]

lol
Well, I think I'll describe him and interests. He reads a lot. He procrastinates a lot. If we have agreed on something, he holds you to it. He likes to be alone but he also likes to be one-to-one..., he's not group focused. He dresses well but conservative and will wear something until it's ready for the garbage. He is very clean and takes care of his appearence. Likes being told he's nice to look at and becomes very affectionate when I give him this type of attention. Oh, here's another..., he likes for me to take the lead with everything. This is trying on me but I'm getting use to it.
I find that he knows so much about everything and he's a professional and so use to a certain level of intelligent conversation at work and with some of his nerdy friends. I'm going with the 9 but he definately has the 5-ish traits as well like in his need to be intellectually challanged and so stimulated quite a bit. I have asked that he more try educating me than expecting me to know so much. I don't have a master degree like he does nor do I have the book smart experience of his everyday reading. I'm street smart.

ummm.... hey Vagabond. Is that your picture in avatar?

[Vagabond]

I'd go with 9w1 too. He is expected to have Fivish traits since he is an INTP, I think most 9w1 INTPs do.... "Likes being told he's nice to look at and becomes very affectionate when I give him this type of attention" was a clear hint as far as I am concerned.

Lol, no that is not my picture Unfortunately this is a male pic, but I was looking for a hooded face when I ran into this one... ahm. You do know I am a female, don't you...? Because I have this curse following me, pretty much everyone mistakes me for a male over the internet...
_________________
Ο δικός μου ο δρόμος μ' έχει χρόνια διαλέξει...
INTP 5w4 sp/sx

[Dee]

I was going to tell you that you're a hotty!! purrrrr ah, what the heck, "YOU ARE HOTTY!!" LOL
Man, do you ever come across as a guy!! I hope you don't mind me saying that. There goes my "oh so frigg'n Holy" intuition out tha door!!

Anyway, thanks for your spin on things. I wish I could say more about him but I'm afraid he'll find this site and give me heck or something. Ha! No, I'm not paranoid it's that he finds my conversations on enneagram interesting and who knows, he might pop in here some day. I started talking to him about this stuff and of course he had many questions I couldn't answer and was able to NT on it like a whip and came up with a bunch of interesting thoughts on the concept. He reads quite a bit on philosophy and some stuff on psychology.
He's a big guy too. 6' 4" and at least 230lb. he's a clumsy guy. he LOVES music that is obscure and so do I so we see live music which I love doing.

[Vagabond]

[Dee]

thanks!